Singing Pig

For what its worth re Uni, based on the fact that the current govt want 50% of all school leavers to go to uni in the next 3 years..its about 43% now...then the value of a degree for the sake of it has to be questioned in my eyes. More so if fundementally you see yourself as an entrepreneur type and not the type who needs the security blanket around them that they rat race offers (to a very limited extenet these days tho!)

I think with uni, the relevance bit is vital as someone said on here. Lets be fair, there are so many mickey mouse degrees out there that really dont open too many doors to anyone. its ok having a 3 year junket, but you have to pay the price later down the line. the junket used to be at the taxpayers expense..but not as much now..all the more reason to consider the value of studying some obscure subject for 3 years..then having no job afterwards.Many like this are bitter and twisted towards society..yet they are their own worst enemies.

You seem to me like a natural entrepreneur type and perhaps you coud compromise and study stuff that is practical and relevant? having said all of that, if you really want to make your mark  and fortune in property, then uni wont help you. Youd be better working in surveying, estate agency or simply linking up with a emtrpreneur who can mentor and direct you....dont complicate things!

As someone who never got a degree - at uni - at a time when they were a rare commodity to have - I have no regrets. I am far more financilly succesful than those i know who did go to uni..and work about half as much as them - when i want. I did a p/t degree in business studies/marketing for 5 years in my own time. It actually made me realise how easy a full time 3 yr course is when you have so much time to do it in and no distractions like a full time job which I had.

Going to uni these days seems a knee jerk ill considered decision by many. It is often i feel a egotistical/leisure decision rather than a calculated carrer move. Nothing wrong in tha -t to a point..but if you are released from there with no real qualities demanded by employees..then it seems all very questionable to me...especially if you have a focussed burning desire (property development/investment) at such a young age already!

Interesting, totally agree with Rialto.

For me I dont regret University as it was a positive experience, however that was before the system was changed.

Having a degree does not place you any higher then those without in any way, if anything you continue being programmed into thinking you have to work for someone and there are no alternatives.

There is no right or wrong answer really, life is a journey with many twists and turns, many challenges and opportunities. I do sometimes think that Uni was a waste of time academically, but then I think of the chain of events that happened and the people I met.

rialto:

More so if fundementally you see yourself as an entrepreneur type and not the type who needs the security blanket around them that they rat race offers (to a very limited extenet these days tho!)

i agree that many people who go to Uni, shouldn't go.  i went because i had a particular career in mind, that required a degree.  our friend here needs to figure out what he wants to do with his life, and then assess whether going to Uni will help him achieve his goals.  if not, then going to Uni is an indulgence ... for example, if you want to be a doctor, you HAVE to go to Uni.  if you want to be an Estate Agent, you don't.

i have to say that i know a large number of graduates that earn very high incomes, and have significant assets.  the defining characteristic though, is that generally those people chose courses that led them into a professional job.  some decided to go self-employed (as i did), others stayed in a job.  some self-employed people (i.e. arguably more entrepreneurial) do well financially, but many (most?) don't.  i know plenty of self-employed people who could earn more by becoming "employed" (although they may have non-financial reasons for staying self-employed).  similarly, i know some very highly paid "employees" ... some people on here might be surprised how much!

it doesn't necessarily follow that going to Uni means you will join the "rat race".  being university-educated doesn't mean you can't also be entrepreneurial.  it's not the "rat race" that provides a "security blanket", it's the skills and knowledge that you are able to sell.  it's very difficult to become a solicitor without a law degree!  but once you have it, you can do the 1-year LPC professional course, a 2-year Traineeship, and get your Practising Certificate ... and off you go, you can set up your own law firm! 

A fair point to certain extent..but in this case (and what I was addressing) was that it appears pretty obvious that this chap doesnt seem to have a calling such as being a doctor/lawyer... whatever.

In my expereince many people who graduate end up doing something that has, at bes,t a tenuous connection with what they learned. apart from the fact they wasted the taxpayers money, they have also deluded and confused themselves by cossetting themselves in a academic environment for 3 years..until reality bites.yes there are many entrepreneurial graduates...there are also many more who couldnt find theri own a** with both their hands tied behind their back - there'll be a lot more too when the process of sending 50% of the school population to uni kicks in soon!!

The rat race may not, as we know, provide a total security blanket - but the general perception is that is what it does provide. Most people who go to uni are simply following accepted logic...'go to schhol/pass exams/go to uni/get'good' job/make good money/be happy..thats too prescriptive for me.

Yes there are many careers where you have to go to uni. I know dozens of disillusioned professionals who are wealthy, but they are exasperated as they feel trapped by their wealth and cannot afford the 'luxury' of a career change. They are extremely specialised in one job.

A great example of this is my neighbour is a surgeon..great job on the face of it..he hates it! Crazy hours, bureacracy, tedious work...great money. He has boxed himself into a corner because he has all his eggs in one basket from a skills angle.

With 50% of the school leavers going to uni soon..we have to accept that getting a degree is not once it once perhaps was.... think about it....50% of all 18 year olds? There are some real dummies out there..can half of them be up to the standard we would like out graduates to ultimately attain..i think not?

I can see you creating your own 'edge' in future..by not going to uni!

rialto:

In my expereince many people who graduate end up doing something that has, at bes,t a tenuous connection with what they learned. apart from the fact they wasted the taxpayers money, they have also deluded and confused themselves by cossetting themselves in a academic environment for 3 years..until reality bites.yes there are many entrepreneurial graduates...there are also many more who couldnt find theri own a** with both their hands tied behind their back - there'll be a lot more too when the process of sending 50% of the school population to uni kicks in soon!!

The rat race may not, as we know, provide a total security blanket - but the general perception is that is what it does provide. Most people who go to uni are simply following accepted logic...'go to schhol/pass exams/go to uni/get'good' job/make good money/be happy..thats too prescriptive for me.

Yes there are many careers where you have to go to uni. I know dozens of disillusioned professionals who are wealthy, but they are exasperated as they feel trapped by their wealth and cannot afford the 'luxury' of a career change. They are extremely specialised in one job.

the problem nowadays is that going to Uni is not subject to "natural selection", as it was when i went (i.e. courses have very high entrance grades in hard subjects!).  nowadays, an "E"-grade A-levels in Home Economics (which you get virtually for turning up at the exam!), will get you in somewhere.  that encourages unsuitable people to give it a go ... when it's not in their interests.  i recruit graduates myself, and i've really noticed the variability in quality.  but, at the same time, there is a core of very bright, hard-working people leaving university ... as there always has been.  it's just that nowadays they are also in the mix with many second-rate graduates - who give the good ones a bad name ...

but ... that's a separate issue to the "rat race". you can be a brain surgeon or road-sweeper, and have a "job mentality" or an "entrepreneur mentality" ... WHAT you do, or sell, is not the issue, except that there needs to be a demand for it, and you need to be particularly good at it.  me?  i'm an accountant who specialises in risk management for large corporates ... and i can do this job as an employee, or self-employed.  i prefer self-employed because i like being in charge of my own destiny, the rates are higher, i can pick and choose my clients ... etc.  but, that decision isn't influenced by whether or not i went to Uni ... the two issues are separate.

 i agree there are many disillusioned people ... but people who "trap" themselves financially have only themselves to blame, and that's not necessarily related to your education or whether you have a job or are self-employed.  that is a situation that cuts across social and economic classes.  there's more to life than money, and more than money as a measure of success ... and few people "get that" ... which is a shame. 

Some of the advice here is great and I really appreciate it.

What Rialto said about being specialised is something I really want to avoid and after months of reading and research I am sure property development/investment is where I want to be, which requires no degree.

 Thanks again.

Tom
 

I'm not sure you should see "being specialised" as a negative.  Your financial success will depend on whether there is demand for your service/product, how many providers there are, and how well they provide it.  A accountant friend of mine started specialising in "derivative accounting", and soon found himself in massive demand as investment banks needed professional advice along those lines, and very few people knew much about it ... his fees are eyewatering!  rialto himself sells a very specialised service, and i'm sure does very well ... so i would keep an open mind. 

good luck!

I think what hursty is looking for is something that wont 'box him in'. He seems to be the type who does not want to get bogged down in something he doesnt ultimately enjoy...but feels he has little option but to continue because he may get trapped by both the rewards and his inability to do something else which he prefers more ...and get the same kind of money. This happens a lot to many people a few years down the line from begining a career.

 This is a common situation for many employees - I know this from the expereince of helping them! I think that uni ultimately, for most people gets you into conventional life and employment thinking..which..lets be fair..isnt necessarily the answer to total enhancement! its a big part of the social engineering that needs to be in place in any developed civilised nation. Not necessarily good for the masses..but great for those who control us.

We can all cite a few people who have had the nous to engineer themselves out of the controlled employment situation they dont like..but they tend to be few and far between. Control of your own life and destiny is worth far more long term than any short term financial rewards a 'top' job can bring. I think for someone like hursty this issue he presents is incredibly important in shaping his destiny. its hard to control  your life because governments cant afford the masses to be totally free....we are engineered from the cradle..and a few manage to do their own thing..an acceptable balance for any govt.

.Any property professional worth their salt on here only has to draw experience form the hundreds of exasperated people we speak to who are depressed, broke and bewildered - many of these people are educated folk (ive just this week done a leaseback with a headmistress 190k OMV paying 140k and getting 850 rent) This lady admitted that whilst she has 2 degrees..she has not an ounce of financial sense. this is not an incommon instance.

Anyway lets hope hursty finds his way...good luck from me too.