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How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

Last post 28 Aug 2008, 9:55 AM by Pod. 5 replies.
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  •  25 Aug 2008, 5:26 PM 565114

    How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

    Hi Guys,
    I'm 24 and been investing in BMV for a few years now.
    I also own a BMV Mortgage Brokers and Bridging Lenders but I'm not posting to promote that side of the business.
    Wanted to know how everyone has been getting on in the last few months with so many changes to the way we can finance purchases, property prices coming down, surveyors doing a lovely job of making rentals extremely difficult to stack, etc.
    I've personally taking a back seat in buying under rates reduce and discounts become higher and focused on other businesses I'm involved with.
    Is anyone in the same boat or think I'm wrong about the future direction of the market?
    I believe we have another 10% - 15% average drop in prices before we see property being profitable to start purchasing again. I know a number of BMV investors who were buying anything all over the country as long as rental assessments stacked and there was a couple of k cash back. These same people are now looking at their highly geared portfolios and wondering what their going to do come re-mortgage time. Does anyone think we, BMV brokers, are to blame for much of this by encouraging first time investors to load themselves with properties when they have little or no experience in the market?
    Would be keen to hear peoples views on the subject.
    Regards,
    Daniel Morgan


    Director
    Fruit Finance LTD
    www.fruitmortgages.com

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  •  26 Aug 2008, 12:54 PM 565648 in reply to 565114

    Re: How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

    Anyone who bought anything that turned out bad should be looking at themself, not others for the blame!

    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery
  •  26 Aug 2008, 3:25 PM 565861 in reply to 565114

    Re: How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

    "Wanted to know how everyone has been getting on in the last few months with so many changes to the way we can finance purchases, property prices coming down, surveyors doing a lovely job of making rentals extremely difficult to stack, etc.
    I've personally taking a back seat in buying under rates reduce and discounts become higher and focused on other businesses I'm involved with."

    couple of points here ...

    1.  property prices falling should help, not hinder, your BMV efforts.  prospects are being conditioned by the media that prices are falling ... you need explain the consequences to your prospects. 

    2.  i'm not sure how surveyors are "making rentals extremely difficult to stack" ... if by down-valuing, that surely makes the yield & interest cover BETTER?!  again, you should be sharing the survey results with your prospects ... and adjusting your offers accordingly. 

    3.  you should be using the high interest rates & tightening lending criteria to obtain higher discounts off BMV ... not backing off ... although these conditions are "bad", they are not half as bad as for some BMV prospects!

    4.  if you genuinely believe that prices will fall 15% more (do yuo really believe we have ANOTHER 15% falls yet to see?!  if so, i don;t blame you for holding off ... i personally am not seeing prices fall much), factor that into your offers.

    5.  if yuo are worried abour re-mortgaging, go for 5-year fixed rate mortgages ,,,, so if prices fall in 2-3 years and then recover, you are not affected. 

    overall, use these times to your advantage ...

    er, thats 5 points!

     


    Houses bought FAST ... Blackpool ONLY
    Finder Fees payable for 25% min BMV
    http://www.blackpoolpropertylink.co.uk
  •  26 Aug 2008, 11:48 PM 566154 in reply to 565861

    Re: How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

    Spot on Pod

     Now is the time to adjust and look for the opportunities, yesterdays market will not make you successful today.  BMV is alive and kicking more than ever and will continue to be, you just need to plan and stick to it !

     If you take your time and research and plan your strategy you will make a killing !

  •  28 Aug 2008, 1:37 AM 567069 in reply to 565861

    Re: How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

    (1) "prospects" as you call them don't care about the media, they care or follow what their outstanding commitments are. Regardless of who we would like to pay they still may have a high LTV mortgages to pay off.

    (2) I was referring to rental assessment rather than property valuation

    (3) See point one

    (4) See point one yet again ( yes i do see prices falling by another 15%, when the flood of BMV property can no longer be financed via BMV structuring how else do you think the current 25%+ discounts will effect the general housing market?

    (5) Why would anyone go for a high bbp rate mortgage over a long term if they believe your assumption that the market will improve in the short to medium term. Going by your advice on property prices in the current market surely investors should opt for short term mortgages if the "believe" rate will fall and property prices will stabilizes.

    (6) For a person whose posts seem to be very anti BMV NMD you seem to be very open to people using their own deposits as potential loss if the market does continue to fall.

    Overall, use these times with caution.

    Err, that’s 6 points!

  •  28 Aug 2008, 9:55 AM 567244 in reply to 567069

    Re: How is everyone under 25 doing in BMV?

    you seem to be a litle prickly daniel ... not sure why? i'll answer point (6) first (!) .... i am not "anti-NMD" as you say. i am anti-fraud.  there is a significant difference, as i'm sure you realise. i have used myself the MX 1 day remortgage approach, no problems with that at all ... why would I?  i do have a problem with dodgy "NMD techniques" that essentially rely on defrauding the lender and / or "compliant" solicitors, and that expose the borrower to the risk of mortgage fraud.  i'm sure that all your brokering is all above board though ... but there are brokers who are not making the risks clear to their clients.

    i am very open to people using their own deposits ... why would i not be?  why would any lender not be?  regardless of whether you have no money tied up in a property, or a 15% cash deposit, or have paid cash, if the property has fallen in value you as an investor have LOST if the market falls .......... this is a really important point.  a loss is a loss, regardless of how its funded.  whether i choose to put a deposit in or not, i am concerned about the soundness of the underlying investment .... buyers lose either way, whether it be their own cash deposit, or the bank's money.  buyers shouln't make the mistake of thinking that because they have none of their own money tied up, they haven't lost.

     

    (1) i can assure you that prospects (that, by the way, is a generally used sales term for "potential clients") are very concerned and influenced by the media.  a key part of the BMV negotiation process is conditioning prospects of the realistic OMV of their prop, and the general state of the market. the media is now doing us a favour .... prospects see and hear about the state of the market, and its therefore easier to get to a realistic OMV (as well as explaining the risk we are taking by holding a falling knife ... which helps justify the profit).

    however, yuo are right that there will be fewer people who can afford to take a BMV offer as prices fall .... these are the people who will have problems if they can't afford their repayments, can't afford to re-finance & can't afford to sell to a trader.  their only options are to sell on the open market & pray for a buyer, or be repo'd.  gulp.

    (2)  i am not finding that my rental assessments are disagreed with by surveyors .... or at least no moer than they have ever been!  maybe thats a regional thing, maybe its becasue i know the 2 or 3 surveyors in my area & they know i don;t shoot too high.

    (3)  you are missing the point.  in these times, there are more and more BMV prospects for you to aim at.  you should be filtering out the non-starters on the phone ... a 5-10 minute job.  if a prospect calls, i deduct 25% from the prop value they give me (it will alwasy be inflated), and if the mortgage is higher than this, i wish them well, & ask if my broker and estate agent can call them, as sadly, i am unable to help. a larger % of calls end like this, but since i am getting far more calls, the actual number of viewings is increasing ... and most importantly, the % BMV is higher.  my point was if we are having problems in the current market, think of the plight of many BMV prospects ... it is disproportionately worse in my experience.

    (4)  i don't expect that the "flood" of BMV props hitting the markets will have any real effect.  BMV is a tiny, tiny section of the housing market.  maybe you deal with BMV every day, but i wouldn;t expect the numbers of landlords selling BMVs that they can't re-finance to affect the entire housing market by -15% ... it is inconceivable. you also asked how i think 25% BMV discounts will affect the housing market ... my answer is, "not at all".  again, the proportion of props sold BMV (and i mean true, true BMV) is tiny ... the impact on the general market is negligible.

    (5)  i didn't give any "advice" on property prices?!  my point was simply that if an investor expects there to be a short-term blip in prices, he can choose a mortgage product that protects him from the need to re-mortgage until prices have recovered. common sense i would have thought? 

    just generally, my experience has been that the current market is fantastic ... if you have cash for deposits.  the reason is that Joe Public tends to over-react to hysterical media claims & so discounts their house lower than they need to.  a good example is nationwide's figures today ........ 2% MOM drop, 10% YOY.  Joe Public thinks what his house is worth, calculates 10% of that, and then panics at the "money" they think they have lost. whereas previously i used to call back all prospects that declined my offer on viewing, i am now finding these people calling ME wanting me to visit them again!!  THAT is teh power of the media ... doing my job for me!

    it goes without saying that caution should be exercised when buying property ... but equally, the current market is perfect for building a quality portfolio ... not the time for standing on the sidelines. 

     


    Houses bought FAST ... Blackpool ONLY
    Finder Fees payable for 25% min BMV
    http://www.blackpoolpropertylink.co.uk
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