Singing Pig

I own a block of flats which originally started life as a 3 bed semi but by way of constructing a single storey triple garage to the side of the house under building regs and then subsequently obtaining p.p. for a first floor extension,was able to achieve a property more than double the original size.Following divorce in the late 80's I retained the property and paid my wife off but the only way this was affordable was to divide the house into 4flats and let three of them out with me residing in the fourth.

The council viewed the property as a HMO but on the turn of keys the flats became self contained and a few years passed when I was granted retrospective planning(lawful development certs.)The flats were then gutted,separate services installed and instead of having a large white elephant on a small estate consisting of mainly 3 bed semis,now have this block of desirable flats with a combined value in excess of £600K.

There is no way this could have been achieved under a straightforward planning application in one go(off road parking issues to name just one of the hurdles)but wondered if this way around planning is still possible or has the loophole tightened.I live in an area of the country whereby the only way to make money out of property is to add value in this or similar sort of way.

Another question......In one of the flats on the first floor,I have high level windows facing the rear garden of my local pub.For the last 15 years I've battled to have trees that border my property on the pub side to be pruned and only 3 years ago had to get my local mediation officers involved before anything was done.Of course the trees have since grown again and now I'm not only suffering with lack of light into the property but now losing my tele signal.I'm aware the new "high hedges act" is in place and confident of being successful if I took the matter up with my local council but they require £450 up front.

Am I correct in saying that I could replace the high level windows with deeper ones without p.p. to allow more light(get even time, as the brewery/landlord wouldn't like the thought of their patrons being looked down on) and if I decided to take the matter up with my L.A. and "won the day",would I be in a position  to get my 450 quid back from the owners of the pub?

My concern regarding the windows is that although the property is just outside the conservation area of the village,now the building consists of flats, whether or not I have permitted development rights to carry out this work.I suppose I could go ahead and apply for retrospective planning and take it to appeal if need be!! 

Regards......Bill 

Buffalo:

I own a block of flats which originally started life as a 3 bed semi but by way of constructing a single storey triple garage to the side of the house under building regs and then subsequently obtaining p.p. for a first floor extension,was able to achieve a property more than double the original size.Following divorce in the late 80's I retained the property and paid my wife off but the only way this was affordable was to divide the house into 4flats and let three of them out with me residing in the fourth.

The council viewed the property as a HMO but on the turn of keys the flats became self contained and a few years passed when I was granted retrospective planning(lawful development certs.)The flats were then gutted,separate services installed and instead of having a large white elephant on a small estate consisting of mainly 3 bed semis,now have this block of desirable flats with a combined value in excess of £600K.

There is no way this could have been achieved under a straightforward planning application in one go(off road parking issues to name just one of the hurdles)but wondered if this way around planning is still possible or has the loophole tightened.I live in an area of the country whereby the only way to make money out of property is to add value in this or similar sort of way.

 

Another question......In one of the flats on the first floor,I have high level windows facing the rear garden of my local pub.For the last 15 years I've battled to have trees that border my property on the pub side to be pruned and only 3 years ago had to get my local mediation officers involved before anything was done.Of course the trees have since grown again and now I'm not only suffering with lack of light into the property but now losing my tele signal.I'm aware the new "high hedges act" is in place and confident of being successful if I took the matter up with my local council but they require £450 up front.

Am I correct in saying that I could replace the high level windows with deeper ones without p.p. to allow more light(get even time, as the brewery/landlord wouldn't like the thought of their patrons being looked down on) and if I decided to take the matter up with my L.A. and "won the day",would I be in a position  to get my 450 quid back from the owners of the pub?

My concern regarding the windows is that although the property is just outside the conservation area of the village,now the building consists of flats, whether or not I have permitted development rights to carry out this work.I suppose I could go ahead and apply for retrospective planning and take it to appeal if need be!! 

Regards......Bill 

Hi Bill

 Yes, you can still get a Lawful Development Certificate if you can avoid the planning authority's interest for long enough.

4 years for operational development, 10 years for a Change of Use, puts the offending development beyond the specified time limit for enforcement action, thereby making it "lawful". An LDC is not the same as a planning permission, but it is "as good as." And they can't consider any of their policies when deciding whether to grant an LDC - they don't come into it; it is simply a legal question - is this development immune ?

"Am I correct in saying that I could replace the high level windows with deeper ones without p.p"

Nope, sorry - absolutely not ! You will be changing the external appearance of the building. And it will (a) be obvious (b) more than likely result in a complaint by the pub, and a retrospective planning application or an enforcement notice which would see you paying double the planning application fee to appeal. You might well end up having to restore the building to its previous state. Not worth the risk !

And no, you wouldn't get your £450 back from the pub owners. Might be cheaper to talk to them, eh ?

Thanks for the reply Trevor......The development in question was carried out many years ago and the planning officer who dealt with the retrospective planning application(LDC's)happened to be the same officer who granted planning permission under his delegated powers for a more recent development I carried out in 2004/2005 which was very similar.I extended and converted a 3bed semi into 2No.two bed flats and 2No.one beds and although the property is in an area of outstanding natural beauty,with planning policy for the village being that further development for existing dwellings should be restricted to two further units maximum,the officer made the point that he could not prevent me from extending the original house and repeating what I had done some years previous and, unlike a planning officer I'm dealing with at the moment, made a logical decision.

Getting back to my question on the windows I wish to replace with deeper ones,I assumed that because the property is outside of the conservation area and over 23 metres away from the nearest dwelling then permission would not be required.Some years ago,I removed a window at first floor which looked onto a flat roof area and installed a patio door which, after a complaint from a neighbour, resulted in a visit from a planning officer.After our discussion the officer went back to her office and later phoned to say what I had done was in fact lawful.The following day a building inspector visited who obviously insisted I surround the now balcony with railings.The railings were being made at the time but once installed I had the planning officer visit again who told me the railings constituted an enclosure for which I would need P.P. and it would not be forthcoming,suggesting I re-install the window.Following an enforcement notice,I met with a solicitor specialising in planning law who after a couple of weeks found a precedent whereby I was able to retain the patio door and balcony.I hope I don't have to go down this route but I'm determined not to be bullied and let a brewery get away with their responsibilities.

For the last 15 years I've tried to put my point over to the landlord and it was only until Mediation had to get involved (for which I had to pay) that anything was done and now I'm back to square one.The landlady even planted Leylandi at the boundary fence adjacent to the ground floor flat kitchen window(3 feet away)and they are now 8 feet tall.Less than 15 feet away there are other Leylandi that are taller than the ridge of the property, with  them now interfering with the television signal.

The other major problem is that it's the only pub in the village!!!

Regards.....Bill 

Trevor....I went to the Planning Portal site and there is only mention it's acceptable to replace windows without P.P. and no mention of enlarging.I then phoned the Planning Dept.,gave the address and the officer informed me that I could enlarge the windows without a planning application....Yipee

Whilst I was typing this, the phone rang and was informed a planning appeal had been successful relating exactly to the main reason for refusal the last time I applied for development for two dwellings on a site I own.

Good news for once.....think I'll have a few beers tonight around the local!!

Bill 

Calm down, Bill !

 Take my advice ... DO NOT TRUST ANYTHING a planning officer tells you ORALLY.

GET IT IN WRITING !   THEN you can start rejoicing.

You don't need permission to replace windows like for like.

You DO need permission if it alters the external appearance of the building.

Trevor.....I know you are giving me sound advice and I've had first hand experience of how not to trust what a planning officer may say orally.On my last application for the two dwellings I mentioned previously,the case officer told my agent she would not determine the application until he returned from holiday.

You guessed it..she reneged and decided against under her delegated powers,saying how planning officers had to work within a time frame.If we had known,the ward councillor would have asked for the matter to be heard by committee.What a ***.

 
Since your last reply I'm starting to have my doubts but another reason to suggest I may not need P.P. is the fact I replaced a window with a patio door at first floor level and it was reluctantly accepted at the time to be lawful.This afternoon I spoke with my planning barrister who's dealing my next application for the two dwellings and mentioned the windows.He also advised I should get the duty officer's comments it in writing but would not commit himself further.I have logged the time/date and name of the planning officer who I spoke with which may help in my defence should I go ahead but, in any event, this will be a last resort if I can't get the brewery to commit themselves to a regular regime of maintenance to their trees.

It's probably premature to rejoice but I'm off to the pub to sink a few anyway.

Regards....Bill 

Trevor...You didn't come up with the replies I was hoping for but because I'm that type of bloke,I had a couple for you anyway.

Burp..Bill